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that solves our deficit problems in a balanced and responsible way. with this congress, that was obviously a little bit too much to hope for at this time. it may be we can do it in stages. >> there are a number of issues on which the two sides are still apart but negotiations are continuing as i speak. but we really are running out of time. >> the vice president and i have worked together on solutions before and i believe we can again. >> no holiday for the best political team around. a triple threat, luke russert and mike viqueira on the capitol hill and kristen welker from the white house. are you happy to be working on the holiday? >> it's fantastic. >> absolutely. >> sounded believable. viq, let's start with you. we have news trickling out today. working, trying to make a deal. what's going on? >> it's washington, d.c. nothing is as it appears. we6 classic kabuki theater going on here, toree. the president, jovial, said they were close to a deal. that joe biden, the negotiations with mitch mcconnell essentially borne fruit. republicans annoyed wit
that solves our deficit problems in a balanced and responsible way. with this congress, that was obviously a little bit too much to hope for at this time. it may be we can do it in stages. >> there are a number of issues on which the two sides are still apart but negotiations are continuing as i speak. but we really are running out of time. >> the vice president and i have worked together on solutions before and i believe we can again. >> no holiday for the best political team...
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, deficit reduction. where do you start with that? what do you think the republican strategy should be? there's been a lot of criticism, as you know. i was thinking about david brooks, who was on "meet the press" over the weekend, and he was saying that the problem with the republicans, frankly sshgs that they have a brain freeze. they have no strategy. is there a strategy? >> absolutely. we work to get a $4 trillion deal, which included a program of tax reform, entitlement reform, and reductions in spending. that didn't happen. we weren't able to get that deal. we got one piece of it, and that is going to help with economic growth because we made these lower tax rates permanent. that's going to help our economy grow, create revenue through growth rather than higher taxes. we have got to do the entitlement reform. we've got to find real savings, and it has to be in that $4 trillion range to reduce the deficit and debt, and i think that also is part of really getting the kind of economic growth we need wit
, deficit reduction. where do you start with that? what do you think the republican strategy should be? there's been a lot of criticism, as you know. i was thinking about david brooks, who was on "meet the press" over the weekend, and he was saying that the problem with the republicans, frankly sshgs that they have a brain freeze. they have no strategy. is there a strategy? >> absolutely. we work to get a $4 trillion deal, which included a program of tax reform, entitlement...
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we need to reduce the deficit. we know we need to reduce spending. any deal in the future that is the rest of this deal and brings it to completion is going to need to have both revenue and spending cuts and we're going to need to make sure that we add entitlement savings. we have that opportunity. the republicans just need to continue to get more of their members to agree to say yes. >> all right. congresswoman debby wassermann schultz, thanks so much for your time. >> thank you, mara. >> so who won, who lost? who compromised and who held firm? where does this leave embattled house speaker john boehner? reed wilson is editor-in-chief for national journal's hotline. thank you both for being here today. ryan, let's talk about what we'll see in the house. do you expect a full scale revolt from conservative members who vowed to vote against any tax increase? >> well, i don't know. we'll find out early this afternoon. what i'm hearing is that the conservative members have three major problems with the bill that came over from the senate. one is that ther
we need to reduce the deficit. we know we need to reduce spending. any deal in the future that is the rest of this deal and brings it to completion is going to need to have both revenue and spending cuts and we're going to need to make sure that we add entitlement savings. we have that opportunity. the republicans just need to continue to get more of their members to agree to say yes. >> all right. congresswoman debby wassermann schultz, thanks so much for your time. >> thank you,...
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and it immediately moved to deficit reduction and how to do it. and that was a very fundamental, important shift in the conversation. >> we have to go, but -- we have to go, but i heard that after the show, sam stein will be on twiner. you can be there, too. >> we can get together. >> we have another important item, though, which is the biggest hurdle arguably to president obama's second term agenda. that's something you're probably never going to hear about, literally. people think of the filibuster as a talk athon to stop action in the senate. but nowadays it has been attacked with a constant extreme of silent filibusters. up next, the talking filibuster ahead live. >>> time for the your business preer oes weeks. amber and mark started north carolina's based footsteps clothing which had a booming christmas themed pajama liven. not wanting to be jump a seasonal line of christmas, they added other opportunities. for more, watch "your business." sunday morning at 7:30 a.m. everyone loves surprise parties. yeah, so last week we had a surprise party
and it immediately moved to deficit reduction and how to do it. and that was a very fundamental, important shift in the conversation. >> we have to go, but -- we have to go, but i heard that after the show, sam stein will be on twiner. you can be there, too. >> we can get together. >> we have another important item, though, which is the biggest hurdle arguably to president obama's second term agenda. that's something you're probably never going to hear about, literally. people...
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forward to deal with comprehensive tax policy in a fair and responsible way and let's deal with the deficit and the balance in a fair away. john boehner basically said no to all of that. and that's really not acceptable leadership. >> is there any -- should harry reid amend the bill that the house sent over at all? the fact is, harry reid has -- needs to add republican cooperation. he wants to say, look, this isn't a game. this isn't show. you know, i can bring out a bill, pass a bill. if john boehner says i'm not going to look at that, what's the point? let's make something happen here. that is what the american people are looking for. we're concerned about the fiscal and economic policies. there's a recovery period that we're experiencing to put more challenges before the economy both consumers and investors. let's create certainty. let's make sure that we pass tax cuts for -- you know, for the majority, the advanced majority, 98%. and let's get that done and move through the regular process to deal with the bigger questions. i'd like to ask you before we go, obviously, the governorship i
forward to deal with comprehensive tax policy in a fair and responsible way and let's deal with the deficit and the balance in a fair away. john boehner basically said no to all of that. and that's really not acceptable leadership. >> is there any -- should harry reid amend the bill that the house sent over at all? the fact is, harry reid has -- needs to add republican cooperation. he wants to say, look, this isn't a game. this isn't show. you know, i can bring out a bill, pass a bill. if...
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. >> if republicans think that i will finish the job of deficit reduction through spending cuts alone, and you hear that sometimes coming from them, sort of after today we're just going to try to shove only spending cuts down -- well, shove spending -- [ laughter ] shove spending cuts at us. if they think that's the formula for how we're going to solve this thing, then they've got another thing coming. >> i wanted to bring in democratic congressman john larson of connecticut with us from capitol hill. thanks for coming in. >> happy to be here. >> i want to talk spending in a moment but, first, what's your reaction to the parameters of a tax deal, a hike on incomes more than $400,000 for individuals, $450,000 for couples. your tlauts houghts on what we o far. >> we really don't know that much. we haven't seen anything in the house of representatives. i just heard luke russert say, you know, the ink isn't dry on any agreement yet. so while we're hopeful that there is an agreement that can be reached and have been prodding our colleagues to do so, things could implode rather easily, as w
. >> if republicans think that i will finish the job of deficit reduction through spending cuts alone, and you hear that sometimes coming from them, sort of after today we're just going to try to shove only spending cuts down -- well, shove spending -- [ laughter ] shove spending cuts at us. if they think that's the formula for how we're going to solve this thing, then they've got another thing coming. >> i wanted to bring in democratic congressman john larson of connecticut with us...
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insurance is still available for two million people and lays the groundwork for economic growth and deficit reduction. >> everything that has been happening in the last several hours has been happening behind the scenes. we have correspondents tracking everything for you. we have luke, luke, i will start with you this hour. the senate officially reconvenes tomorrow afternoon. i assume that there's a lot of closed door talks going on right now. is that true? what can you tell us? >> reporter: that is true, staff from harry reed and mitch mcconnell have been negotiating through the daout the day and in picked up. we have heard that both sides are not budgeting. but we don't know, things can change at any moment. if we have to gauge how to talks have gone so far from the conversations we have had here around capitol hill, they have not been too good at the moment. all that being said though, craig, there's a lot that can happen over the next 48 hours. the deal obviously is to try to have something on the floor that can pass the house of representatives by new year's eve. that is why it's so di
insurance is still available for two million people and lays the groundwork for economic growth and deficit reduction. >> everything that has been happening in the last several hours has been happening behind the scenes. we have correspondents tracking everything for you. we have luke, luke, i will start with you this hour. the senate officially reconvenes tomorrow afternoon. i assume that there's a lot of closed door talks going on right now. is that true? what can you tell us? >>...
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>> there area i variety of different things and the obvious one is we're running a national deficit at a scale that's unsustainable. when it's over $1 trillion like it's been for the last three years that will create some situations where just crisis emerged. that's the first part. the second part is the economy and not pointing fingers at anybody, but the economy is not back on track. there's still a significant level of unemployment and the amount of people who are actually participating and the workforce is down, so you have all of the economic components of this constant situation of where there are these constant fiscal problems. having said that, one of the things that you're seeing in this particular debate and why i'm feeling better about this particular exchange is the sense that, look, when the policy outcome becomes greater than the political payoff, that's when you see bipartisan ship begin to emerge and i think what you're seeing from both sides is the policy outcome is becoming more important and you'll see it program that we'll move in that direction from the fiscal clef
>> there area i variety of different things and the obvious one is we're running a national deficit at a scale that's unsustainable. when it's over $1 trillion like it's been for the last three years that will create some situations where just crisis emerged. that's the first part. the second part is the economy and not pointing fingers at anybody, but the economy is not back on track. there's still a significant level of unemployment and the amount of people who are actually...
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who should pick up the burden for deficit reduction? working people who have seen their wages go down or the top 2% who have done phenomenally well, while their effective tax rate, as mitt romney reminded us by not releasing his tax returns, is extremely low. so to my mind, what this deficit reduction debate is about is asking the wealthiest people, the large corporations to help us with deficit reduction and give a break for a change to the middle class and working families. >> as you say, one that would mean less money for seniors with the social security adjustment is off the table, are you more optimistic about getting a deal done. >> we still have a long way to go. >> what do you see as the major sticking point? >> one of the sticking pointing, what the republicans want to do is continue the 2010 agreement on lower estate tax rates, which means, chris, $120 billion tax break over a ten-year period for the top 0.2 of 1%. they get $120 billion tax break. and people come forward and say we're very serious about deficit reduction. thir
who should pick up the burden for deficit reduction? working people who have seen their wages go down or the top 2% who have done phenomenally well, while their effective tax rate, as mitt romney reminded us by not releasing his tax returns, is extremely low. so to my mind, what this deficit reduction debate is about is asking the wealthiest people, the large corporations to help us with deficit reduction and give a break for a change to the middle class and working families. >> as you...
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they want them to carry the burden of reducing the deficit and refuse to ask higher income individuals to pitch in to fully share responsibility. and that is exactly what is happening. it is important to know that republicans are now demanding that the wealthiest of the very wealthiest estates in this country get a sweetheart deal on estate taxes which would help 7,200 families in the country next year get an average tax break of $1.2 million. and they are holding up tax relief for everybody else in the country in order to get this demand met for the very wealthiest estates. this isn't even the top 1%. this is a fraction of 1%. while they want to give those folks a big break they want folks on social security to pay more. and so this is a major setback. it is interesting to hear mitch mcconnell talking about his good faith efforts. he knows that he just threw a monkey wrench into the negotiations y. think he is also doing it to protect speaker boehner and the republicans and the house because he doesn't want to send them a deal that he knows they are going to vote down. >> let's talk a
they want them to carry the burden of reducing the deficit and refuse to ask higher income individuals to pitch in to fully share responsibility. and that is exactly what is happening. it is important to know that republicans are now demanding that the wealthiest of the very wealthiest estates in this country get a sweetheart deal on estate taxes which would help 7,200 families in the country next year get an average tax break of $1.2 million. and they are holding up tax relief for everybody...
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doesn't contribute to the deficit. and we're talking about the deficit. why should social security be discussed in that context? >> completely off the table? >> absolutely. absolutely. and that was the -- and that was our position during the campaign. social security has nothing to do with the deficit. does not contribute to it. walled off from it. its own trust fund with $2.7 trillion in it at the moment. and the american people by huge majorities say we shouldn't be cutting social security or for that matter medicare benefits. you can cut medicare in ways you don't cut benefits and the hypocrisy of republicans that said that democrats are terrible because they took $716 billion from medicare for obama care and what do we want to do? pocket the cuts and add more. our chief demand is entitlement cuts. medicare and social security. >> talk about the debt ceiling and where this is played in to this conversation. that is coming up in february or supposed to come up in february. john boehner made the offer to take it off the table for a year but i want to sho
doesn't contribute to the deficit. and we're talking about the deficit. why should social security be discussed in that context? >> completely off the table? >> absolutely. absolutely. and that was the -- and that was our position during the campaign. social security has nothing to do with the deficit. does not contribute to it. walled off from it. its own trust fund with $2.7 trillion in it at the moment. and the american people by huge majorities say we shouldn't be cutting social...
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we still have deficits that have to be dealt with. we're still going to have to think about how we put our economy on a long-term trajectory of growth and how we continue to make investments in things like education, things like infrastructure that help our economy grow. keep in mind that the threat of tax hikes going up is only one part of this so-called fiscal cliff that everybody has been talking about. what we also have facing us starting tomorrow are automatic spending cuts that are scheduled to go into effect. keep in mind that some of these spending cuts that congress has said will automatically go into effect have an impact on our defense department, but they also have an impact on things like head start and so there are some programs that are scheduled to be cut that we're using an ax instead ax instead of a scalpel. may not always be the smartest cuts and so that is a piece of business that still has to be taken care of. and i want to make clear that any agreement we have to deal with these automatic spending cuts that are b
we still have deficits that have to be dealt with. we're still going to have to think about how we put our economy on a long-term trajectory of growth and how we continue to make investments in things like education, things like infrastructure that help our economy grow. keep in mind that the threat of tax hikes going up is only one part of this so-called fiscal cliff that everybody has been talking about. what we also have facing us starting tomorrow are automatic spending cuts that are...
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too much deficit reduction, too quickly, and we could push the economy into a recession. that's just dumb. >> it is very dumb. now, you've been in many, many, many of these negotiations? you've been in the backrooms of a lot of the ongoing negotiations, now, do you think they have any chance of getting a deal before the first of the year? >> i'm always hopeful, but i'm less hopeful as every day passes. the problem is the rhetoric that's flying back and forth between republicans and democrats sounds like we're still having an election that it never was over. i think that now -- now that we've had an election, and the american public has spoken, whatever they meant, it's time for the politicians to get together, come together as starbucks is saying, and get something done. nobody's going to get everything they want. but it's so much more important to solve the problem than for one side or the other to get what they want or blame the other. the atmosphere is just wrong. >> when you hear the argument for going over the cliff. when it's been told to me by both democrats and re
too much deficit reduction, too quickly, and we could push the economy into a recession. that's just dumb. >> it is very dumb. now, you've been in many, many, many of these negotiations? you've been in the backrooms of a lot of the ongoing negotiations, now, do you think they have any chance of getting a deal before the first of the year? >> i'm always hopeful, but i'm less hopeful as every day passes. the problem is the rhetoric that's flying back and forth between republicans and...
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americans looking for a job, and lays the ground work for future progress on more economic growth and deficit reduction. >> republicans say they want a deal as well, but they highlighted their biggest sticking points today in their weekly address. listen now to missouri senator roy blount. >> senate democrats have spent months drawing partisan lines in the sand. the president's proposal to raise tax on the top 2% of americans won't even pay one-third of the annual interest that's now owed on this massive $16 trillion debt. in fact, the president's tax hike would only fund the government for eight days. >> the senate is set to reconvene sunday at 1:00 eastern time. the house expected to be in session sunday. are going to start around 2:00 with the first votes coming around 6:30 p.m. let's head on over to the white house. kristen welker standing by. a lot happening in washington, d.c. a lot happening i would assume at the white house. but how engaged is the presidented to in moving this thing forward? >> reporter: good afternoon, t.j. i am told there are conversations going on at the staff leve
americans looking for a job, and lays the ground work for future progress on more economic growth and deficit reduction. >> republicans say they want a deal as well, but they highlighted their biggest sticking points today in their weekly address. listen now to missouri senator roy blount. >> senate democrats have spent months drawing partisan lines in the sand. the president's proposal to raise tax on the top 2% of americans won't even pay one-third of the annual interest that's...
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number one they don't like the extension of unemployment benefits and think that adds to the deficit. they don't think there are enough spending cuts. they also don't like the extension of the middle class tax cuts that were the president's stimulus package. also some liberals don't like the bill because they feel it gives, takes away their leverage to argue for more taxes in the future in terms of deficit deals and the rest of them would only come by cuts. so what you're going to see is at noon, nancy pelosi is going to talk to the house democratic caucus. there have been some rumors that joe biden could come up here on new year's day to sell the plan, very much like he did to the senate ds earlier this morning. you'll also see john boehner meeting with his conference at 1:00 p.m. i've been told by folks close to boehner that these -- it is by no means a done deal. he is keeping the door open to possibly amending the senate bill. now you think with the 9 votes they wouldn't want to do that, they'd want to put this to bed. but the house republicans have been known to scuttle these typ
number one they don't like the extension of unemployment benefits and think that adds to the deficit. they don't think there are enough spending cuts. they also don't like the extension of the middle class tax cuts that were the president's stimulus package. also some liberals don't like the bill because they feel it gives, takes away their leverage to argue for more taxes in the future in terms of deficit deals and the rest of them would only come by cuts. so what you're going to see is at...
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don't forget who asked and demanded for deficit reduction. when i talked to a capitol hill staffer, here's what he said. he said -- this is very important -- "if it's a status quo election some kind of deal that staifz off sec quest rags. >> the republicans. >> i have to say it, it is the republicans that the point that are arguing against deficit reduction. they want to cancel the see quester, which is military spending cut. >> only on their terms. >> they would like spending cuts, but they would like -- they won't be ebbing mrift about exactly how do do it. >> i want to give luke the last word on this. >> is there a chance? just your kind of read on the final word on this, do we end today with some kind of a deal, or do they punt this and try to do it before january 3rd or not at all, just go over the cliff? >> i think that there's a possibility you could see a deal come out of the senate today, although i think if any deal comes out of the senate, the house will most likely vote on it tomorrow. i don't see a late night new year's eve vote
don't forget who asked and demanded for deficit reduction. when i talked to a capitol hill staffer, here's what he said. he said -- this is very important -- "if it's a status quo election some kind of deal that staifz off sec quest rags. >> the republicans. >> i have to say it, it is the republicans that the point that are arguing against deficit reduction. they want to cancel the see quester, which is military spending cut. >> only on their terms. >> they would...
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at the moment we will have a fairly modest amount of deficit reduction. maybe even none at all. mixed with a fairly bad economic impact from the fiscal cliff. kicking some of the sequester down the road would be a good idea but it's the same disagreements keeping us from doing that that has kept us from getting a bigger deal. >> where we are right now and what we know about this, sam, is it clear whether one side gave more than the other? >> you know, it's just the first chapter of a several-chapter book here because now we're going to have to deal with the debt ceiling fight and republicans have been calculating that they want to extract some concessions from the white house on that. that can't be considered separate from what we're talking about today. of course, we have to do the sequestration and what will happen with those cuts. so it's too early to tell who wins, who loses. i'll add to ezra, the big losers i guess are us, and me in particular standing out here in the cold on new year's eve over a manufactured crisis. >> there are a lot of us who did not expect to be here a
at the moment we will have a fairly modest amount of deficit reduction. maybe even none at all. mixed with a fairly bad economic impact from the fiscal cliff. kicking some of the sequester down the road would be a good idea but it's the same disagreements keeping us from doing that that has kept us from getting a bigger deal. >> where we are right now and what we know about this, sam, is it clear whether one side gave more than the other? >> you know, it's just the first chapter of...
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i think that would be a tough lift considering president obama offered $400,000 with $2 trillion in deficit reduction. >> from where you sit right now, i mean, you're so into the house gop, jake, i'm surprised you didn't end up in boehner's suitcase, we look like we're going over. >> it looks like that's the case and that's what gop aides are telling us today, it's very difficult and democrats are saying this too, it's difficult to see a way we avert the fiscal cliff at this point with how slow the senate operates, no plan right now, house is nowhere, and it's almost january. >> highway to the danger zone, jake sherman, politico, thank you so much for joining us, we appreciate it. >>> developing news on president george h.w. bush's health. this is "andrea mitchell reports" only on msnbc. we've all had those moments. when you lost the thing you can't believe you lost. when what you just bought, just broke. or when you have a little trouble a long way from home... as an american express cardmember you can expect some help. but what you might not expect, is you can get all this with a prepaid
i think that would be a tough lift considering president obama offered $400,000 with $2 trillion in deficit reduction. >> from where you sit right now, i mean, you're so into the house gop, jake, i'm surprised you didn't end up in boehner's suitcase, we look like we're going over. >> it looks like that's the case and that's what gop aides are telling us today, it's very difficult and democrats are saying this too, it's difficult to see a way we avert the fiscal cliff at this point...
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we are looking at the deficit of this year and looking at deficit of that size as far as the eye can see and not how to put together a minor package as chuck was talking about. this is the larger deal. the problem you have, obviously, not much time so i think you're likely to see a two-step process here. dealing with the immediate dynamics to, in fact, set up a situation to deal with the larger situation. but ultimately, here, the other element to occur is this is a real negotiating process. i have to say i was disappointed in the president when he used this line, when the speaker said to him, hey, i'm giving you $800 billion. what do i zbhet the president's response was nothing. the white house has to come up with -- >> the response of the white house is times is different. 2011 is 2011. doesn't speaker boehner get less out of a smaller deal? >> no, no. i think he wants a larger deal and going back to august of 2011, they were -- they got very close to the large deal. richard, pushing back in terms of a little bit in terms, look, this is a negotiating process. one side can't say you
we are looking at the deficit of this year and looking at deficit of that size as far as the eye can see and not how to put together a minor package as chuck was talking about. this is the larger deal. the problem you have, obviously, not much time so i think you're likely to see a two-step process here. dealing with the immediate dynamics to, in fact, set up a situation to deal with the larger situation. but ultimately, here, the other element to occur is this is a real negotiating process. i...
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and really, is not interested in a balanced approach to deficit reduction. it's been pretty clear that that's the story we have been telling and it happens to be the truth. >> i understand that two of colleagues proposed cuts to medicare for a hike in the debt ceiling. what do you make of that offer? >> i think one of the things that people don't realize is that it's a dirty little secret. the republicans don't want to cut the things that americans want cut. and they want to cut things that americans don't want cut. poll after poll shown americans do not want deficit reduction done by cutting medicare and medicare and social security. so they propose and saw the same scenario when paul ryan put the budget out and because the american people rejected the kind of draconian cuts that the republicans want to make so, you know, that's a nonstarter in the senate. i think it's a nonstarter with the president. sure can pass the house but going nowhere past that. >> the smaller offer we hear that the president is making at 3:00, to congressional leadership, what kind
and really, is not interested in a balanced approach to deficit reduction. it's been pretty clear that that's the story we have been telling and it happens to be the truth. >> i understand that two of colleagues proposed cuts to medicare for a hike in the debt ceiling. what do you make of that offer? >> i think one of the things that people don't realize is that it's a dirty little secret. the republicans don't want to cut the things that americans want cut. and they want to cut...
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as a former governor, we don't operate with big deficits. you can't do that and we're in trouble in this country financially. the long term and in the short term, yes, we'll have a recession. it won't be a bad one but it will be one and nobody wants a recession. in the long term i think wall street goes crazy and you will see 15,000, 17,000 in the dow because finally somebody has done something serious about the deficit. i don't believe they will if they come to an agreement. >> you know, governor rendell, i want to know if you agree with governor dean. part of the message, one of the things that strikes me, the message for so long has been we can't go over the cliff, we can't go over the cliff. here are all the things that will happen to individual americans if we go over the cliff. there's a lot of anxiety out there. we've been hearing about that, we've seen the markets up and down. to some degree, i understand the political arguments but in terms of the argument of the stability of the country and our economy, do you agree with governor d
as a former governor, we don't operate with big deficits. you can't do that and we're in trouble in this country financially. the long term and in the short term, yes, we'll have a recession. it won't be a bad one but it will be one and nobody wants a recession. in the long term i think wall street goes crazy and you will see 15,000, 17,000 in the dow because finally somebody has done something serious about the deficit. i don't believe they will if they come to an agreement. >> you know,...
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reduce the deficit by 10 or 12%. so it's a question at this point of what sort of hollow, empty meaningless symbolic gesture daus washington want to make and how many group of people do they want on the altar to make that gesture. >> what's so interesting here is that we're talking about the republicans fighting to protect 1.2% of the american public from a tax increase. 98.2% of taxpayers are below the $250,000 threshold so it's kind of amazing in congress, particularly when we're talking about the house, that he's made a pledge around tacks that its willing to allow 98.2% of americans to pay more by going over -- around this curve, it's more of a curve than a cliff. but i think the issue of the deficit is important. i don't think it's a symbolic gesture. one of the things that we've seen is $200 million we've started carving off the deficit. and the question is the time frame of deficit reduction, right? it's how fast, over what time trajectory do we see health? we've been making improvements over the past three ye
reduce the deficit by 10 or 12%. so it's a question at this point of what sort of hollow, empty meaningless symbolic gesture daus washington want to make and how many group of people do they want on the altar to make that gesture. >> what's so interesting here is that we're talking about the republicans fighting to protect 1.2% of the american public from a tax increase. 98.2% of taxpayers are below the $250,000 threshold so it's kind of amazing in congress, particularly when we're...
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republicans would like to see more deficit reduction. so, they're saying if there are new taxes, spend it down on the deficit, don't use it for spending. chris? >> now, kelly, one other quick question. you've been up there probably for the last 96 hours, maybe more straight. what's the mood? i know we've got this report that mcconnell and joe biden worked late into the evening and that there seems to be a little bit more positivity than maybe when people like me went to bed last night, a little early. so, is the mood moving in the direction of a deal? is that what -- because it seemed like pessimism sort of toward the late afternoon yesterday. where are we right now, quickly? >> reporter: it does fluctuate. there is exasperation and frustration, especially from members here waiting to vote on something but have nothing to look at. they are wanting to see something done. the people closest to it tell us they are still working at it, that they see there isn't one particular issue that would make this all fall apart, but they're not there y
republicans would like to see more deficit reduction. so, they're saying if there are new taxes, spend it down on the deficit, don't use it for spending. chris? >> now, kelly, one other quick question. you've been up there probably for the last 96 hours, maybe more straight. what's the mood? i know we've got this report that mcconnell and joe biden worked late into the evening and that there seems to be a little bit more positivity than maybe when people like me went to bed last night, a...
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that has to be part of the discussion down the road, whether it's with respect to deficit in a few month or sequestration or other things, the department of service is another thing. a lot of neocon friends on the right think it's psycho. but the reality, everything has to be on the table if we're honest with the american people about getting our fiscal house in order. they need to know the american people, exactly what the costs are, the consequences are, the priorities are quite frankly, milissa. we need to find a balance between guns and brothers or will we live in an absolutist world where you can't have one without the other? i think that will be part of the sequestration as well. >> the heritage foundation came out and said -- basically gave it a huge thumbs down. how does this affect republicans who vote for it? is that something they carry with them in deciding this? >> i think it will be. i think with the change occurring with leadership and the fact that they are talking about scoring members, republican members on how they vote on matters going forward, yeah, i think some will
that has to be part of the discussion down the road, whether it's with respect to deficit in a few month or sequestration or other things, the department of service is another thing. a lot of neocon friends on the right think it's psycho. but the reality, everything has to be on the table if we're honest with the american people about getting our fiscal house in order. they need to know the american people, exactly what the costs are, the consequences are, the priorities are quite frankly,...
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future negotiations and likely future fights about how to deal with paying for a way to bring down the deficit by other kinds of cuts. that's been at the heart of this fight. now, today the house of representatives comes in, they cast a vote, and because the senate vote is so overwhelmingly bipartisan, 89-8, it's hoped that that will have influence in the house to at least get this deal done now with a chance to talk about some of these issues some more in the new congress and in the months ahead. chris? >> kelly o'donnell, thank you. well, all eyes do now turn to the republican-controlled house and speaker john boehner. about two hours before the senate voted, the house leadership said it would take a wait-and-see approach. "decisions about whether the house will seek to accept or promptly amend the measure will not be made until house members and the american people have been able to review the legislation." with me now, "the washington post's" david machimura and steve toma, chief political correspondent for "mclatchy" newspapers. good morning. >> good morning. >> happy new year. >> happy n
future negotiations and likely future fights about how to deal with paying for a way to bring down the deficit by other kinds of cuts. that's been at the heart of this fight. now, today the house of representatives comes in, they cast a vote, and because the senate vote is so overwhelmingly bipartisan, 89-8, it's hoped that that will have influence in the house to at least get this deal done now with a chance to talk about some of these issues some more in the new congress and in the months...
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medicaid deficit finance right now. those are key parts of a safe bet that we'll b will be fallinr their own financial weight unless they are fixed. what we really have to do on behalf of the next generation. gerri: they want to raise the debt ceiling again, as a matter of fact by monday we will be out of dough. it is unconscionable to me we are in this position again. let's remember what happened last time. the market sold off, the economy went into the tank. will that happen all over again? >> i think it is a serious possibilities out like to make that they don't mix the debt ceiling in with the fiscal cliff. we have to get to next without a self-inflicted recession and take on the debt ceiling which a symptom of the national debt. if we can deal with the national debt, we can get a deal on the debt ceiling. but that is a lot of work. gerri: the war of words going on is not helping. harry reid saying it is republicans fault and somebody from boehner's office said harry reid has to talk less and legislate more. it is c
medicaid deficit finance right now. those are key parts of a safe bet that we'll b will be fallinr their own financial weight unless they are fixed. what we really have to do on behalf of the next generation. gerri: they want to raise the debt ceiling again, as a matter of fact by monday we will be out of dough. it is unconscionable to me we are in this position again. let's remember what happened last time. the market sold off, the economy went into the tank. will that happen all over again?...
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cut part of the deficit? bring all 3 million of that one weapon back in, let the government, county, state and federal, pay you to take them back. you do don't need them. >>> we have to leave it there. thank you for your time. >>> speaker boehner has said it's up to the senate and the president to come up with a fiscal deal, but as some point out, he'll have to push a bill through the house. given last week's events it won't be easy. "the washington post" columnist e.j. dionne says that may be the silver lining, writing, quote -- now at least we know something important. the current rep majority cannot govern, only a coalition across party lines can get the public's business done. e.j. joins us now, a senior fellow with the brookings institution and an msnbc contributor. e.j., great to see you, as always. john boehner sits to the left of center of his caucus. can he work out a deal without inciting a full-scale revolt? >> well, we don't know that, but i think he'll have to test it. that really tells you somet
cut part of the deficit? bring all 3 million of that one weapon back in, let the government, county, state and federal, pay you to take them back. you do don't need them. >>> we have to leave it there. thank you for your time. >>> speaker boehner has said it's up to the senate and the president to come up with a fiscal deal, but as some point out, he'll have to push a bill through the house. given last week's events it won't be easy. "the washington post" columnist...
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working with house speaker john boehner and trying to get a big deal that dealt with tax reform and deficit reduction. that fell apart and talks have largely been stalled this entire time. there was a lost pressure to get something done. we have seen some of the impacts of the fiscal cliff. consumers saying they have been more cautious with their holiday spending because of the uncertainty in washington. economists warn it could get worse and the markets could be foiled if we go over the fiscal cliff. taxes will go up for the average american by about $2,000 and could put us back into a recession. >> which nobody wants to see. kristen welker in hawaii. the president is coming back, but they haven't gotten the 48 hour notice. they are very much out there in play. thank you very much for joining us. appreciate it. when the senate returns tomorrow morning, there will be a new emphasis on members taking a larger role in the fiscal cliff negotiations that based off the current offer may only have a smaller deal. a member of the budget committee and outspoken voice on the left side of the aisle.
working with house speaker john boehner and trying to get a big deal that dealt with tax reform and deficit reduction. that fell apart and talks have largely been stalled this entire time. there was a lost pressure to get something done. we have seen some of the impacts of the fiscal cliff. consumers saying they have been more cautious with their holiday spending because of the uncertainty in washington. economists warn it could get worse and the markets could be foiled if we go over the fiscal...
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because more people would be paying more taxes or breaking up the big banks to prevent more costly deficit expanding bailouts in the future or how about creating a single payer health care system would cut into half our deficit it do see in health care costs if all of these things were on the table this would be a robust debate that reflects the political leanings of a center left nation but they are not on the table which shows not just the weakness of president obama but also the weakness of the progressive movement when compared with the hard right movement which is funded by cranky billionaires like the koch brothers karl rove and sheldon adelson labor unions which have historically been the vanguard of the progressive movement have been crippled and independent media including print radio and t.v. which used to carry the voices of average working people across the nation through locally owned radio and t.v. stations have been bankrupted and sold off to large corporate media outlets that spew lies and misinformation to promote the billionaires agenda. essentially the progressive counte
because more people would be paying more taxes or breaking up the big banks to prevent more costly deficit expanding bailouts in the future or how about creating a single payer health care system would cut into half our deficit it do see in health care costs if all of these things were on the table this would be a robust debate that reflects the political leanings of a center left nation but they are not on the table which shows not just the weakness of president obama but also the weakness of...
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the deficit of about $1 trillion that is for fiscal 2013. that assumes that somehow the fiscal cliff doesn't happen and we don't reduce the deficit by $600 billion. national debt, about $16 billion , debt held by the public -- as a percentage it is getting up there. we've had it before. as we talked about two weeks ago it is not so much that the size of the debt it is how fast the debt is growing in comparison to the size of the economy. you don't want to pay off the debt but you want it to fall. host: how did we get to this point? why is the government spending so much and under this president, we've seen the debt go up $1 trillion each year over the last four years. where is it going? guest: there are two main ways to look at it. right now, we're still coming out of this economic crisis. so you have large debts for four years mainly because you have low revenues as people don't have jobs or they are getting paid less. then there has been extra spending programs over the last four years but also, we have this mandatory spending programs tha
the deficit of about $1 trillion that is for fiscal 2013. that assumes that somehow the fiscal cliff doesn't happen and we don't reduce the deficit by $600 billion. national debt, about $16 billion , debt held by the public -- as a percentage it is getting up there. we've had it before. as we talked about two weeks ago it is not so much that the size of the debt it is how fast the debt is growing in comparison to the size of the economy. you don't want to pay off the debt but you want it to...
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. >> catherine, isn't it their deficit in large part deficit? >> of course, but they have political amnesia. ideology is the science of idiots. here's one of these moments where when you live inside the box and refuse to look at empirical evidence, refuse to understand history to show us how economies work, how tax cuts or increases affect populations, then they are going to follow this line of idiocy over their own, i think, political cliff. and the partisanship is going to wreak tremendous havoc on the republican party in the upcoming elections. >> we have limited time. i want to go back to john harwood. is there a time here, john, when we're going to see the markets start to react or are we expecting most traders to wait until after the first to make big decisions? >> i think that's when they reacted. if we go over the cliff, even for a couple of days, you're going to see a reaction. i think at the end of the day you will see action if we go over the cliff for a couple of days, because i don't agree with jonathan that they are immune to publi
. >> catherine, isn't it their deficit in large part deficit? >> of course, but they have political amnesia. ideology is the science of idiots. here's one of these moments where when you live inside the box and refuse to look at empirical evidence, refuse to understand history to show us how economies work, how tax cuts or increases affect populations, then they are going to follow this line of idiocy over their own, i think, political cliff. and the partisanship is going to wreak...
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so all of this takes place against a debate about how to reduce the budget deficit. that's why you get into this theater of the absurd. >> well, and look at the tape you showed at the opening of the program with keith boykin over and over again showing the dysfunction of congress. they made this so onerous with the belief it would make them do something less onerous and now they're right up against it. >> they really know how to make these crises happen. political correspondent and writer, john howard, thank you very much for joining me and former labor secretary robert reich, thank you for joining me tonight. >>> coming up, the nra has done much more damage than you think. and they've made gun ownership much harder to trace. >>> and the romneys keep trying new explanations for why mitt lost. but they aren't getting any closer to the truth. and as some of you on twitter already know, i am wearing a christmas gift or two on the show tonight. there is still time to tweet your guesses about what it is. the answer to what christmas gift or gifts am i wearing is coming up
so all of this takes place against a debate about how to reduce the budget deficit. that's why you get into this theater of the absurd. >> well, and look at the tape you showed at the opening of the program with keith boykin over and over again showing the dysfunction of congress. they made this so onerous with the belief it would make them do something less onerous and now they're right up against it. >> they really know how to make these crises happen. political correspondent and...
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agrees that you can't set this nation's economy on a healthy path that cease going to take care of our deficit and make it a managinin bart of gdp. he knows we can't asked the republicans to raise it 1.2, 1.3 trillion in revenue. he's reached out and made cig nif kant concessions and the response to that was nothing. it is pathetic. >> jaret, let me ask you, if we go over the cliff, what ps? is there not an immediate impact on people with unemployment insurance and other things? i mean, what happens if we go over this cliff? >> well, you really have to distinguish between going over the cliff and quickly reversing the damage, meaning in a matter of weeks, which is still impossible. if we go over and stay over, a couple of million people will lose their unemployment benefits. eventually, taxes will increase for millions of others. the payroll tax holiday will probably be gone either way. once we go over the cliff, the economic pain will be forthcoming. >> and can be significant. give me a yes or no. are we going over the cliff? or will it be a last-minute deal? >> i think we're going over. >> y
agrees that you can't set this nation's economy on a healthy path that cease going to take care of our deficit and make it a managinin bart of gdp. he knows we can't asked the republicans to raise it 1.2, 1.3 trillion in revenue. he's reached out and made cig nif kant concessions and the response to that was nothing. it is pathetic. >> jaret, let me ask you, if we go over the cliff, what ps? is there not an immediate impact on people with unemployment insurance and other things? i mean,...
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we'll be increasing the deficit. it is just, i think, hard to step back and take in the totality of congressional failure around this issue. >> well, let's talk about what exactly is likely to happen or is the threat of what will happen. talk about the pentagon. talk about federal workers. talk about obviously the unemploy unemployed whose benefits are going away. >> absolutely. the biggest -- the most dangerous thing, the fiscal cliff is the unemployment insurance. if we go over for a month we can sort of trick everything else. we can -- the irs can do some tricks to make it so you don't feel tax increases quickly. we can do tricks to make it so we don't lay off people at pentagon, we can furlough them. there's no trick with unemployment insurance. if we go over the cliff and don't do anything by unemployment insurance, 2 million people, hardest hit by the recession, will lose their unemployment insurance. that's number one. we're going to have the payroll tax cut expire, that's probably going to happen if we do rea
we'll be increasing the deficit. it is just, i think, hard to step back and take in the totality of congressional failure around this issue. >> well, let's talk about what exactly is likely to happen or is the threat of what will happen. talk about the pentagon. talk about federal workers. talk about obviously the unemploy unemployed whose benefits are going away. >> absolutely. the biggest -- the most dangerous thing, the fiscal cliff is the unemployment insurance. if we go over...
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you need also to have less deficit on the part of government and transfer it to the states. more decentralized decision making. why? because if you do you have decentralized errors. not one error dragging you down and last decade two errors in the down. iraq war. you know? it was a horror from human side. but it cost between 40 and 120 times the original estimates. you don't want mistake that is are very large. a fragile system is one in which mistakes are costly and the benefits are small and anti-fragile system is one in which mistakes are small and bring long-term benefits. we want to be in that environment and environment that ben filths of mistakes. >> i hear what you're saying. shifting the debt burden from the federal government and states and federal government is a better position to carry debt. states have these constitutional balance budget amendments and bail out the states, isn't it? >> this is exactly the problem we have is that the government finds it easy to borrow and runaway deficit. let me explain the big thing. a project in the uk where we have good data,
you need also to have less deficit on the part of government and transfer it to the states. more decentralized decision making. why? because if you do you have decentralized errors. not one error dragging you down and last decade two errors in the down. iraq war. you know? it was a horror from human side. but it cost between 40 and 120 times the original estimates. you don't want mistake that is are very large. a fragile system is one in which mistakes are costly and the benefits are small and...
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paul rooip, the big deficit guy, or so he says, he was on the simpson-bowles commission, and he voted against it, as did every other house republican on the commission. the white house saw no reason to embrace something that raised taxes so sky high and so the white house brought out something that was frankly to the right of simpson-bowles. their budget was to its right and they thought it had a better chance of passing. they thought it was a compromise. but the house republicans did not respond the same way. when they brought out the ryan budget, which was their budget alternative, they didn't compromise. they went way to the right. there was no xriemz compromise t all. that is fact number one. number two, in 2010 republicans won the midterm election. 2011 the white house agreed to a deal that was all spending tucu. it is the budget control act. it cuts spending by $1.8 trillion over the next decade. except for an increase in pell grants, the bill is all cuts, no taxes. and democrats agree to that. they agreed. that is fact number two. fact number three. at this point even after win
paul rooip, the big deficit guy, or so he says, he was on the simpson-bowles commission, and he voted against it, as did every other house republican on the commission. the white house saw no reason to embrace something that raised taxes so sky high and so the white house brought out something that was frankly to the right of simpson-bowles. their budget was to its right and they thought it had a better chance of passing. they thought it was a compromise. but the house republicans did not...
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this is a plan that is not really enough to achieve the kind of fiscal sustainability in our deficit that -- one might have hoped out of a deal like this. this deal also does nothing about the debt ceiling. so unfortunately, we'll be back in a few months about another deal. on new year's eve, let's kind of put that aside for now. >> well, see you in a couple of months then, economist jared bernstein, thank you so much, happy new years to you. you are watching "msnbc," the place for politics. >>> welcome back to our breaking news coverage of the fiscal cliff deal from capitol hill. lawmakers in the white house have reached a tentative deal the avert the across-the-board tax increases, and huge spending cuts regarding the sequester. joining us is the host of "politics nation," the reverend al sharpton. thank you for taking time out of your new year's eve. and i'm sure that this is a subject of great interest to you. >> no, it is a very much -- of a concern to me. and one of the things that i'm very happy about if this deal is voted in, is that people that are depending on unemployment
this is a plan that is not really enough to achieve the kind of fiscal sustainability in our deficit that -- one might have hoped out of a deal like this. this deal also does nothing about the debt ceiling. so unfortunately, we'll be back in a few months about another deal. on new year's eve, let's kind of put that aside for now. >> well, see you in a couple of months then, economist jared bernstein, thank you so much, happy new years to you. you are watching "msnbc," the place...
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years, 1% or 2% of the population, they need to contribute a little more to that restructuring of our deficit situation. so i don't think this is political at all. the politics ended on election day. the president made his case, he made it very clearly. there is no doubt as to what was at stake in that election and the president was elected overwhelm lig. so the politics are over. now we're trying to govern the country and i think that's, at least in the house. >> congressman, i got to speak with you twice over the last several days. i appreciate your time. >> you, too. >> this video just in from the scene of a fire in the rochester, new york area. it's reported two firefighters were shot after responding to a large fire at 6:00 this morning. they encountered gun fire as they were getting out to the fire and immediately retreated. one firefighter was shot in the buttocks and is reported to be in satisfactory condition. it's believed that three houses and one vehicle are involved in that fire. residents in the area have been asked to stay in their homes away from windows and doors. we'll keep
years, 1% or 2% of the population, they need to contribute a little more to that restructuring of our deficit situation. so i don't think this is political at all. the politics ended on election day. the president made his case, he made it very clearly. there is no doubt as to what was at stake in that election and the president was elected overwhelm lig. so the politics are over. now we're trying to govern the country and i think that's, at least in the house. >> congressman, i got to...
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and the way we avoid further debt and deficit is to cut spending. >> will we hear -- their -- come up with debt limitations again the boehner principle for every dollar the debt limit is raised we have a cut in spending. that seems to me that -- where there is a huge ideological divide between both parties, republicans say the problem is about spending and democrats say it is all about lack of revenue, how -- how does -- is that bridged in this year? can it be bridged? >> yes, it can. both president obama and speaker boehner have already begun to do a principle compromise. speaker boehner said i'm ready to raise taxes on those over a million dollars. president obama said i'm ready to have a new type of chain to consumer price index which -- impacts entitlement reform. the bipartisan national debt commission, simpson-bowles commission, said for every dollar of spending reduction, including the entitlement reform we immediate to have $1 in tax revenue. that's the principle compromise we have to have. so they are not far off. what we have to have is very simple. $4 trillion in debt reduc
and the way we avoid further debt and deficit is to cut spending. >> will we hear -- their -- come up with debt limitations again the boehner principle for every dollar the debt limit is raised we have a cut in spending. that seems to me that -- where there is a huge ideological divide between both parties, republicans say the problem is about spending and democrats say it is all about lack of revenue, how -- how does -- is that bridged in this year? can it be bridged? >> yes, it...
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that plan would have dealt with tax reform and deficit reduction and this will be a much more scaled back version that will deal with the issue of taxes and that is still the big sticking point, taxes. of course, democrats and president obama have called for tax rates to increase on those making $250,000 or less. republicans have said that's way too low. so they're thinking about potentially compromising on a rate that would be $400,000 or $500,000, but some republicans are saying they don't think that the tax rate should go up on anyone. so taxes still the major sticking point. right now the negotiations are going on the hill and there's a lot of optimism that came from the talks yesterday. of course, president obama hosted congressional leaders at the white house and they left that meeting and many said that it was constructive and they were optimistic that a deal could get done and i've been talking to my sources today and that same optimism isn't really present right now. there's more skepticism about a deal getting done and it is still very early in this process and this is a fl
that plan would have dealt with tax reform and deficit reduction and this will be a much more scaled back version that will deal with the issue of taxes and that is still the big sticking point, taxes. of course, democrats and president obama have called for tax rates to increase on those making $250,000 or less. republicans have said that's way too low. so they're thinking about potentially compromising on a rate that would be $400,000 or $500,000, but some republicans are saying they don't...
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house and speaker were getting close to getting a big deal that would have included tax reform and deficit reduction. that fell apart. house speaker john boehner tried to get his own bill through the house. he realized he didn't have enough votes for that. that fell apart as well. the ball is in the senate's court. according to an aide, senate majority leader harry read will not bring a bill to the floor unless he believes he will not have the support to get it passed or at least not to block it. that is the strategy right now. president obama will be working with what ma jority leader reid trying to get something through. the president wanted a big deal given the time constraints and only six days left, he conceded to a big deal is probably not possible. the goal now is just to get a gap measure to prevent the steep tax hikes from kicking into effect and the deep spending cuts. right now that is the large goal. i can tell you that competence in lawmakers is dwindling according to the latest poll. 50% of americans believe that lawmakers will be able to prevent going-over the fiscal cliff.
house and speaker were getting close to getting a big deal that would have included tax reform and deficit reduction. that fell apart. house speaker john boehner tried to get his own bill through the house. he realized he didn't have enough votes for that. that fell apart as well. the ball is in the senate's court. according to an aide, senate majority leader harry read will not bring a bill to the floor unless he believes he will not have the support to get it passed or at least not to block...
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Dec 27, 2012
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. >>> it looks like they're pointing -- >> and politicians, and so what we're sealing is -- for deficit reduction. and spend seg cuts off their shoulders, and make it inevitable, saying, you know what? it didn't just happen to them. they pass the sequester, which contained severe, rapid definite at this time reduction. it was almost inevitable, almost the moment they passed the sequester. >> to you, ryan, i was alluding to how both sides are saying different things. two members of the house said this last hour. we had one democrat and one republican. take a listen. >> i think there's still a chance to get something done. that's what happened in the budget deal, i think that's what will happen again. >> it seems like they could even say what will happen. at this point i'm going to side with pollsters saying it won't happen. boehner is at his weakest point ever. to push something through. doing that would weaken him even further. he still needs to be elected speaker on january 3rd. if you're boehner, you let this thing slide past january 3rd, getting yourself elected, and then do what you
. >>> it looks like they're pointing -- >> and politicians, and so what we're sealing is -- for deficit reduction. and spend seg cuts off their shoulders, and make it inevitable, saying, you know what? it didn't just happen to them. they pass the sequester, which contained severe, rapid definite at this time reduction. it was almost inevitable, almost the moment they passed the sequester. >> to you, ryan, i was alluding to how both sides are saying different things. two...
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Dec 30, 2012
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it ought to be about reducing the deficit and the debt, and what they are essentially suggesting is we want new taxes. we want higher taxes on people in this country to pay for new spending. >> so what happens next? with us nbc news capitol hill correspondent mike vic rah and nbc news white house correspondent kristen welker. mike, let's get started with you. what's happening right now in the senate. i understand there's an update on the chained cpi. >> reporter: they say the darkest hour right before the dawn, melissa. everybody ought to hope that's true, at least if you don't want to see your taxes go up on midnight on monday and tuesday night because everything seems to be at a standstill right now. let's review the bidding. here it is from a republican source here on the republican side of capitol hill. all day yesterday they were trading proposals back and forth. by his count two democratic offers came back to republicans and four came back from republicans to democrats. the last one being at 7:00 last night, and, boom, after that, things pretty much came to a standsti standstill.
it ought to be about reducing the deficit and the debt, and what they are essentially suggesting is we want new taxes. we want higher taxes on people in this country to pay for new spending. >> so what happens next? with us nbc news capitol hill correspondent mike vic rah and nbc news white house correspondent kristen welker. mike, let's get started with you. what's happening right now in the senate. i understand there's an update on the chained cpi. >> reporter: they say the...
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Dec 30, 2012
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it will raise our deficit to somewhere around $1 trillion. i think we have to get aggressive about spending. we're going to have to look added title months if we're going to start to solve these problems. -- entitlements if we're going to start to solve these problems. i think the approach he has taken is one that is setting this process up for failure. the proof is the results of negotiations we have seen over the last couple weeks. >> would you have voted for plan b? >> as someone who has been out here in indiana, i do not know all the details of plan b. i know the basic framework. i support the speaker's efforts to try to at least be part of leading. some of the criticism the speaker has received for even proposing such a proposal has been unfair. >> you mentioned how the freshman class is going to be part of a bigger change, and will have seen more than a third of the body turn over in three years. it seems to me that it used to be that after an election, and we had a fairly slow november, fairly slow december, there is an agglomeration,
it will raise our deficit to somewhere around $1 trillion. i think we have to get aggressive about spending. we're going to have to look added title months if we're going to start to solve these problems. -- entitlements if we're going to start to solve these problems. i think the approach he has taken is one that is setting this process up for failure. the proof is the results of negotiations we have seen over the last couple weeks. >> would you have voted for plan b? >> as someone...